Charging for inexperience

Just need some charging advice. I wasn’t planning to start marketing myself as a web developer/designer just yet, but in the last 24 hours, 2 bits of web work have literally fallen in my lap (and far be it from me to look a gift horse in the mouth!), both of which want to pay me, but clearly have approached me assuming I will be cheap as I’m new to it all. I know it’s standard to have an hourly rate, but I’m too slow at hand coding still to justify doing that.

One is a completely new site for a friend who has a sign writing business – he just wants a very simple gallery of around 20 thumbnail photo examples of his work (he has all the photos already) that link to the larger pictures, a bit of info about his company, and a contact form. No shopping facility.

The other is a bit of an overhaul of an existing site, no redesign as such, but updating various things – they’re a bit vague about what they actually want because I don’t think they know, so I’ll be suggesting things (like maybe next time they do a site, don’t do it in Frontpage!).

Would I be best to quote an hourly rate, but only charge them for a fraction of the hours it actually takes me (which I’m happy to do at this stage), or charge a fixed rate for however long it takes me. (I’ve absolutely no idea how long it will take me though being so new n’all). What would be the going rate for someone who is new and inexperienced, but cheap and keen?!

If you are still slow at coding, then I would charge hourly. That's not fair to them unless it's $5 an hour!

I'd put together a package price. Understand what they want then charge what you feel is fair. $100? $200? What are they willing to pay.
My suggestion on both is to do a great job. If it means redoing the frontpage site competely for little money so you can have it to begin building your portfolio. I'd say do it like you would a brand new client and fix it up completely. Wow them.. Price is irrelevant at this point.

Hope that helps.. and I'm psyched for you!

Thanks, that does help. I'm psyched for me too; actually I'm chomping at the bit to get started (not sure why I keep using horsey proverbs today, they just seem to fit!), unfortunately I have to fit it in around my full-time day job, so I can feel a few all-nighters coming on!

Saw a typo in my post... if you are slow at coding I WOULD NOT charge hourly. sorry.
Love the horse references since I'm a horse owner!
Full time jobs stink when they get in the way of fun projects!

It's ok, I had figured that's what you meant - the sentence after it kind of clarified that!

You can take a horse to water, but you can't make him drink (yeah...that one doesn't fit quite so well this time )

Like Lchad said, I would charge by project also. The only time I change hourly is if I have maintenance to do.

But ... as long as you get paid even if it 50$ it's ok ... just never do work for free

Thanks Karinne. I've already saved some of your useful links from archive postings and I'm sure I'll be referring to them with these projects. I'm trying to instil confidence in my 2 clients by answering "yes" to every question they ask that begins "Do you know how to..." or "Are you able to...". I figure the answer will be out there somewhere! Hope this is the right approach

Maybe not ... The time you spend searching for the info is time you spend NOT working on the site. Granted you don't charge by the hour so it's not so much a big deal. Still ... don't be afraid to tell them the you can't do certain things.

I'm not afraid to tell my clients that I don't do Flash! I just don't have the time to learn it and be very good at it. BUT I do tell them that if they ABSOLUTELY NEED it then I can find someone else to do that little portion of it.

But flash is usually unnecessary for the projects that I usually get.

I've spent most of my career telling people I can do things and then spend the time learning how. I consider it the "cost of education". Over time I've gotten quite an education. I am at the point in my career however that I'm not interested in learning certain things and will tell a client "sorry I don't do that type of site or feature". But since I've built up quite a clientelle, I have the financial freedom to say that.

Another good approach is to say "I'm not sure if I can do that, let me research it and get back to you". Then you have covered your butt!

Ok, I think I've just been scared of losing my first 2 clients by having them think I can't do something, but I guess if I say I can, but then can't deliver that's much worse!

Maybe I'll try something like "That might not necessarily be the best thing for your site, let's discuss what it is you're trying to achieve with that and then we'll look at the options".

Ahhh, Karinne. I am going to have to teach you flash. It is so simple...and I know you would love it!

But yeah, I agree with everyone else, right now just charge by the project.

Thanks for everyone's advice. In the end I told him £40 for the new website (that's $80 for anyone who doesn't know the exchange rate is currently 2:1 he he). Just a token fee really, but it'll be my first payment for a website we'll see if I'm brave enough to post it up for critique when it's done.

I sent the guy who wanted the site overhaul some of my initial thoughts on what should be done, and he sent me back an email today saying "It's great to finally find someone who knows what they're talking about", so time for another grin Haven't settled on price with him yet as we still have to sort out what he actually wants done.

Vanessa, one more very critical thing...Make sure you get the arrangement in writing and signed by you and the client. Once you start taking money, your friends become clients and you have to deal with them as a professional business person. Contract, contract, contract. If you need help, let me know.

Thanks, yes, I had vaguely thought about a contract but haven't done anything, so any pointers would be much appreciated - I was thinking of Googling for some standard web contract examples and adapting to suit, but there's probably a better way of going about it? I do have some experience of drawing up contracts at work, for project funding, so some aspects of that would probably be the same.

Vanessa, this is a great place to start....http://provider.com/contracts.htm

Thanks, that is indeed a good place to start

"Charging for inexperience" can be a tricky balance.

You should definitely offer some kind of discount compared to a fully experienced professional. But be careful not to undersell yourself; you may be taken advantage of.

It's okay to do free or "almost free" work, but you must put a strict, short time limit on it. Otherwise, what happens when your client says, "Would you mind adding this...?"

I've only been paid for web design once, and that was partly in the family. But because the project scope was not clear, I charged an hourly rate: £20 an hour (this was commensurate with my normal charge for professional services; now my rates are slightly higher).

It's a good thing I did charge hourly, because the project expanded. They didn't know what to say on their website, so I spent much of my time as a copy editor and in long discussions about content, trying to tease out the company's message. I also recreated their logo, because the (expensive) graphic designer had not supplied good files.

At the end of it, I added up my time and took off 25% for time spent learning rather than working efficiently. I ended up with £3000.

If I'd charged a fixed fee, I would have done a month's work for a day's wages.

I'm not saying you should charge hourly; but if you don't, be sure to limit the scope of the projects you get involved in. They can easily expand.

Thanks Mike. This particular project is sorted, but that's a good idea about charging a standard hourly rate and then decucting a percentage for learning time at the end - I'll keep that in mind for future projects.

Vanessa,
You should only start charging hourly rates when you are skilled enough that your work takes hours rather than days or weeks. You need to understand there is a whole different set of dynamics when you work for others. And you never ever charge them for Learning your job, never!! A client will appriciate you more for your honesty than for the fact you make a promise you may not be able to keep. You are selling your services as a professional.

Yep, understood, which is why I only charged £40 for this first site which is basically like doing it for free, but at least I can say I was paid to do a website! And they understood that it was a learning thing for me, so everyone was happy